Decidim.GOV: Democratic Governance for an open community
#decidimgov Internal organization, democracy and decision making
Supports are subject to the following rules:
- You can support up to 10 proposals.
- In order to be validated proposals need to reach 5 supports
- Each proposal can accumulate more than 5 supports
[ES] Establecer cuotas para socias de la entidad según el rol
Establecer una cuota para administraciones socias en función de su tamaño (cuota mayor para administraciones grandes y menor si son administraciones más pequeñas).
Establecer una cuota para las empresas socias del Decidim y una cuota menor para entidades sociales y personas a título individual.
Las cuotas deben dar derecho a determinados servicios: asesoramiento, formación, novedades, etc...)
[EN] Establish quotas for members of the entity according to the role
Establish a quota for partner administrations according to their size (higher quota for large administrations and lower if smaller administrations).
Establish a quota for member companies of the Decidim and a lower quota for social entities and individuals.
The quotas should give right to certain services: advice, training, news, etc ...)
This proposal has been accepted because:
Proposal accepted for obtaining the minimum support established and included in the Internal Regulation in category 5. ECONOMIC SUSTAINABILITY; Annual membership fees, which should be developed later, since a proposal for categorizing members and quotas is necessary and proposing when these can be made effective through specific services.
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12 comments
Conversation with Virgile Deville
I like the differentiated membership fee idea. It's a good way for individuals, associations, businesses and institutions to signal membership to an association. It can be associated as one of the mandatory thing to do to be granted a voice in the assembly.
I'm not sure about the idea of granting training and other services upon paying a membership. The association in my mind is not the right vehicule to provide services on top of Decidim, I would leave that to organizations and individuals in the community that try to provide services (technical or not) around Decidim to institutions.
This is an interesting debate! I am not totally sure either, but I think it is OK for the community to have some service provision of its own. I am not sure how other Free/Libre Software Foundations do it, maybe we should check it out.
Will try to clarify what I mean here.
I don't think the Decidim association should become a service provider in the same way Open Source Politics or other businesses do it with its clients, providing day to day support, training, custom dev etc. This a highly time consuming activity that will mess with the focus the association needs to have to fulfill its mission. This said, it doesn't prevent the association of holding collective training session, provide other type of broad services related to onboarding for example. What I'm warning is the dependance implied in client <--> provider relationship which I think won't be good for the independance of the project.
De acuerdo con @virgile_deville en matizar el tema de servicios. Aunque la comunidad tiene sus mecanismos de apoyo técnico, formación y intercambio de conocimientos ( SOM, LABs, ....) la palabra servicios crea confusión y responde a un lenguaje economicista que es mejor cambiar.
Me gusta la idea de que las socias tengan alguna ventaja, aunque creo que la más importante es poder participar en la toma de decisiones de Decidim. Pero no me convencen los ejemplos que aparecen: "asesoramiento, formación, novedades, etc..." Todo el mundo debería de tener acceso a las novedades y a la formación, yo creo que otros ejemplos más adecuados tienen que ver con la certificación, o algunas formas de asesoría. Para la redacción final lo dejaría abierto y sin especificar, pero subrayando el derecho a decidir como una ventaja importante.
Conversation with Oliver Valls
I also agree with @virgile_deville and @xabier that the Decidim association does not have to provide consultancy services as the companies in the current ecosystem do. Otherwise Decidim association itself will compete with currently collaborating companies and this will cause a repelling effect. Also which company would like to pay the quota to a competitor of its own?
On the other side, I also think that allowing to take part into governance decisions is a motivating element to pay a quota for.
I agree with you but not 100%. I don't think consultancy should be necessarily out of scope for the association. We need to see how this would work for companies. Surely something to be discussed in detail. I was simply suggesting we should not grant specific "rights" other than some open suggestion on top of the very motivating decision making and perhaps some certificates.
Conversation with Maite López Sánchez
I am not sure about individual fees if the association means to be open and inclusive. I understand a fee for profit organisations, no so sure for non-profit...
For-profit organizations don't have fees, because they have profit. Non-profit organizations have usually fees, precisely because they don't have profit. Here is a list of non-profit organizations that have fees for their associates:
- Unions
- NGOs: Amnesty International, Greenpeace, etc.
- Sports federations
- Alternative and open media: like eldiario.es, pikaramagazine, elsaltodiario.com, ctxt.es, etc.
They all provide free services precisely because the associates pay fees and keep the projects sustainable and autonomous.
Yo tampoco estoy de acuerdo con un sistema de cuotas, si más con un sistema de aportaciones. Monetarias y no monetarias. Tal y como aparece en esta propuesta: [ES] Contribuir a la entidad a través de servicios o desarrollos / [EN] Contribute to the entity through services or developments y escribo en comentarios, entidades pequñas sin ánimo de lucro o individuales podrían colaborar de diversas formas. Ayudando en los eventos y encuentros o aportando de otra manera.
De hecho, creo que puede ser interesante un sistema de aportación por porcentaje o número en casos de instalaciones, desarrollos, etc. En el caso de asesoramientos o acompañamientos o formaciones quizá la aplicación de algún tipo de certificación que paga la entidad contratante y que puede ir íntegra a Metadecidim. (La emisión de certificación, no el trabajo a realizar)
Jo crec que un sistema de quotes té el benefici que és una manera de generar ingressos per l'organització, però que ha de proporcionar uns drets/avantatges a canvi. A la proposta ja es parla de diferents tipus de quotes segons el tipus d'entitat que s'associa. No cal que les quotes siguin grans, que siguin assequibles perquè tothom hi pugui accedir, però que suposin un mínim compromís amb l'organització.
Més que res perquè una organització com aquesta té uns costos fixes d'infraestructura que cal finançar sí o sí. Si puc obtenir els mateixos drets fent les col·laboracions que ja faig habitualment perquè pagar la quota?
Tot i això si l'organització va sobrada d'ingressos també és raonable la opció [ES] Contribuir a la entidad a través de servicios o desarrollos / [EN] Contribute to the entity through services or developments , però només en aquest últim cas
Estan d'acord en que el pagament de cuotes no es mala idea.
Jo ho veig que hi ha 2 possibilitats:
A l'estil d'una associació amb socis fa lobby per alguna causa comuna. Els socis paguen una cuota, que no sol ser molt elevada ja que es pretén tenir un gran nombre de socis. Jo seria més aviat partidari d'aquesta opció.
L'altre seria a l'estil Linux Foundation, que els socis paguen cuotes elevades i segons el pagament tenen més o menys influencia en les desicions de la fundació. Es clar que això crea una oligarquia, no necessariament dolenta, funciona en alguns casos, no estic segur que en el nostre.
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